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| 6 DEC 2003 at 3:44pm |
Jeroen StoutSchattenjger
Posts : 2798
Joined: 14 NOV 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By SirDave (5 DEC 2003 7:42pm)
This has nothing to do with 'being against the Myst folks'. It has nothing to do with the whole 'Myst vs. other adventure genres'. Apparently, you're just determined not to get the point no matter how basic the explanation. Too bad, so sad.
Not to worry though, age often brings wisdom.
> In your case however...
Look, would you get that message that I just wrote?! I said 'SORRY' for turning it into Myst vs. whatever, and I said 'SORRY' for being WRONG. Now, please, would you just accept that I MAY change my oppinion, and that I'm not that rotten, and that I CAN understand what it is about!
My point here is, that Randy gives the 'money-losers'-list as an excuse for his rants about the games, and I used Riven as an example (I'm not that much against the game, seriously) of what I thought was a Turkey, because --read the article-- Randy brings the games down, and calls them turkeys. Leave the first lines of that article and you'll have "My least favorite games, by Randy".
I got it wrong, but to my point of view so did Randy. I'm just a bit offended. I can stand somebody saying that it sold bad, but he rants the games. That's my point.
Now please, stop the "Parrot is against Myst, and calls it a turkey, let's Q.E.D. him to the death!" thank you very much...
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 4:29pm |
| Deleted User | In your case however...
Look, would you get that message that I just wrote?! I said 'SORRY' for turning it into Myst vs. whatever, and I said 'SORRY' for being WRONG. Now, please, would you just accept that I MAY change my oppinion, and that I'm not that rotten, and that I CAN understand what it is about!
My point here is, that Randy gives the 'money-losers'-list as an excuse for his rants about the games, and I used Riven as an example (I'm not that much against the game, seriously) of what I thought was a Turkey, because --read the article-- Randy brings the games down, and calls them turkeys. Leave the first lines of that article and you'll have "My least favorite games, by Randy".
I got it wrong, but to my point of view so did Randy. I'm just a bit offended. I can stand somebody saying that it sold bad, but he rants the games. That's my point.
Now please, stop the "Parrot is against Myst, and calls it a turkey, let's Q.E.D. him to the death!" thank you very much...
You're missing the point. Again. Read the article. Also, don't flame SirDave.
By the way, Q.E.D. is a statement placed at the end of a math problem to show that you have proved something. It's not as insulting as you seem to think.
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 4:42pm |
Jeroen StoutSchattenjger
Posts : 2798
Joined: 14 NOV 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By Fickfack (6 DEC 2003 4:29pm)
don't flame SirDave.
He started it
Originally Posted By Fickfack (6 DEC 2003 4:29pm)
Q.E.D. is a statement placed at the end of a math problem to show that you have proved something. It's not as insulting as you seem to think.
Didn't know that. I 'heard' of it, yet I didn't know the exact meaning.
But I don't get what point I'm not getting? He <is> ranting about the games, isn't he?
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 6:10pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By The_Parrot (6 DEC 2003 4:41pm)
But I don't get what point I'm not getting? He <is> ranting about the games, isn't he?
Randy is "ranting" about the games on the list because they have major problems. You are "ranting" about Riven because you dislike Myst and all similar games. There's a big difference between harsh criticism and genre bashing.
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 6:29pm |
Jeroen StoutSchattenjger
Posts : 2798
Joined: 14 NOV 2003
Status : Online | In a way he is genre-bashing as well, because the games are just adventure games that sold bad.
He has just found an excuse to rant about games he didn't like.
And I do not like all games similar to Myst. Just Riven and Exile, but let's <not> discuss that (we'll get back to the old discussion if we do that)...
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 7:35pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4953
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By The_Parrot (6 DEC 2003 6:29pm)
In a way he is genre-bashing as well, because the games are just adventure games that sold bad.
He has just found an excuse to rant about games he didn't like.
And I do not like all games similar to Myst. Just Riven and Exile, but let's <not> discuss that (we'll get back to the old discussion if we do that)...
My friend, you're like someone who has unknowlingly stepped into quicksand and the more you thrash around, the more stuck you get. When you come into a forum like this, it's a good idea to intially tread lightly and get to know people. As time goes on you get a feel for what comments generate a good discussion vs. provoking a negative reaction.
Rule 1: Don't come on a forum and start off by trashing the guy that runs the damn thing: 'Let's throw this Randy Sluganski along with the parrot in his cage.' I'm not here to defend Randy because he doesn't need any defending. (He usually just stays quietly on the side-lines.) But the fact is- he has achieved a credibility you (and I) haven't, which means he can write eloquent articles (with a certain dramatic license) that stimulate thought and interest in these games and do it in a way that you & I wouldn't be able to. For instance, I don't think he would be surprised to find out that his writing about games he called 'turkeys' actually stimulated interest in those games; for all we know, that might have been one of his purposes for writing the article in the first place.
Rule 2: Don't throw out a number of provocative statements and then be surprised by a provocative response. We're not a bunch ignorant wimps. And you haven't been flamed; you've simply gotten responses commensurate with the tone of your very first post.
Finally, don't start feeling unwelcome here because of some of these comments- we are a rather nice bunch here once you get to know us. And if you think you're getting a sermon from on high here, forget it- you're getting helpful advice from someone who got royally knocked over the head (in retrospect, justifiably) on another adventure forum when I went crashing in with provoking comments in my first few posts.
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 8:09pm |
Jenny100Guild Master
Posts : 3510
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By dombrewer (6 DEC 2003 2:47pm)
>> Does that mean Uru is a turkey?
I haven't played it yet, so I can really comment. Depends on how high you think the expectation of the game was (I was a bit skeptical when I heard about it).
If you expected great things and ended up particularly disliking it, then yes, I'd say you'd found yourself a personal turker. If many folks agree with you then it is more than likely a fully fledged clucker.
I haven't played it yet either.
But I've read a lot of posts by disappointed gamers.
Some gamers thought they were getting a Myst-or Riven-style game, with the accent on solving puzzles. Instead they got something with a lot of jumping and a clumsy control system. Not the "mind-bending puzzles" advertised on the box.
And some were expecting an online game. Apparently the game was released before it was ready. They're still doing beta testing on the online part and only a few people who bought the game have been allowed in.
So it seems to me that this game "promised great things, but then failed to deliver."
So far anyway.
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 9:46pm |
Jeroen StoutSchattenjger
Posts : 2798
Joined: 14 NOV 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By SirDave (6 DEC 2003 7:34pm)
My friend, you're like someone who has unknowlingly stepped into quicksand and the more you thrash around, the more stuck you get.
Thanks... I'm from a forum where I am known, so I got a little to worked up (and where I live nobody knows adventure games, so my opinion is 'the one' there).
So my excuses with this (little voice keeps telling me 'arrogant bastard' now), you know by now that I'm against, yet I said it a bit drasticly (for I got a little angry). :-[
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| 6 DEC 2003 at 10:28pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4953
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By The_Parrot (6 DEC 2003 9:45pm)
Thanks... I'm from a forum where I am known, so I got a little to worked up (and where I live nobody knows adventure games, so my opinion is 'the one' there).
So my excuses with this (little voice keeps telling me 'arrogant bastard' now), you know by now that I'm against, yet I said it a bit drasticly (for I got a little angry). :-[
Nice reply! FWIW: The term 'arrogant bastard' and the name 'SirDave' have probably been associated with each other more than once in past discussions.
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 7 DEC 2003 at 7:38pm |
cesarbittarIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 32
Joined: 21 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | If you can't understand how The Crystal Key is the best seller of TAC, I will never understand how Myst can be the best-selling game of all times and genres (I believe it still is).
I've finished the game only once in my life, after having started playing it like 5 times (I finally sat down and said "I need to finish this" and see what the fuzz is all about). Tell me about overrating something.
Riven is still on my shelf. I've started the game like 3 times at least, and I just can't deal with it. It's just BAD.
Give me a plot-driven, 3rd person, emotionally filled game anytime. Give me GK or BS, or even Final Fantasy.
César
Cesar Bittar
CEO
Phoenix Online
http://www.postudios.com
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| 7 DEC 2003 at 9:26pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By cesarbittar (7 DEC 2003 7:38pm)
If you can't understand how The Crystal Key is the best seller of TAC, I will never understand how Myst can be the best-selling game of all times and genres (I believe it still is).
I've finished the game only once in my life, after having started playing it like 5 times (I finally sat down and said "I need to finish this" and see what the fuzz is all about). Tell me about overrating something.
Riven is still on my shelf. I've started the game like 3 times at least, and I just can't deal with it. It's just BAD.
Give me a plot-driven, 3rd person, emotionally filled game anytime. Give me GK or BS, or even Final Fantasy.
César
Some people like Myst, some don't. It's obvious that the gameplay of the series simply doesn't appeal to you, just as the gameplay of an FPS doesn't appeal to me.
Does that mean all FPS are bad? Of course not. I simply don't enjoy playing them.
Sorry you didn't like it; now you know to avoid Myst-style games in future.
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| 7 DEC 2003 at 11:26pm |
Jenny100Guild Master
Posts : 3510
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By cesarbittar (7 DEC 2003 7:38pm)
If you can't understand how The Crystal Key is the best seller of TAC, I will never understand how Myst can be the best-selling game of all times and genres (I believe it still is).
It's because casual gamers who usually don't buy games bought Myst.
And then they bought Cryst al Key thinking it would be like Myst.
Crystal Key also has the distinction of remaining on the shelves of the stores that were "counted" by the people who made up the best-seller list for a lot longer than most adventure games. So availability and lack of alternate choices for non-violent games had a lot to do with it.
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| 8 DEC 2003 at 5:21pm |
| Deleted User | I was immensly dissapointed by Phantasmagoria
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| 8 DEC 2003 at 11:52pm |
ratracerIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 41
Joined: 21 OCT 2002
Status : Online | So, came on... how isn't City of Lost Children in that list???
It was based on the (great) movie of the same name, was created by one of those good adventure games french companies (I don't recall the name), had terrific graphics (whence I saw those in a magazine, I rushed and bought it)... so all reasons for high expectations, but the game doesn't deliver ANYTHING at all!!! o t even an ending!!!
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| 9 DEC 2003 at 8:03am |
SusanGuild Master
Posts : 5485
Joined: 13 OCT 2002
Location: 0
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By ART_Adventures (8 DEC 2003 5:21pm)
I was immensly dissapointed by Phantasmagoria
Now THERE's a good example of a turkey. :
I miss my Bubba: 1986 - 2006.
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| 9 DEC 2003 at 6:58pm |
ElfstoneGuild Master
Posts : 5892
Joined: 4 NOV 2002
Status : Online | Originally Posted By SirDave (6 DEC 2003 10:28pm)
Nice reply! FWIW: The term 'arrogant bastard' and the name 'SirDave' have probably been associated with each other more than once in past discussions.
You are the one who said that!
I think Randy didn't (or did try not to ) rant about the games he presented, but the definition of "turkey" in the first paragraph is very much about ranting. Which started the confusion.
[b]playing[/b]: Destination Treasure Island (done in two sittings, but it's nice), Syberia (ho-hum), Dracula: Last Sanctuary (on hold)&&[b]reading[/b]: even more study papers&&[b]listening to[/b]: [url=http://www.last.fm/user/Brax82/]this and that[/url], plus [url=http://www.musicovery.com/]Musicovery[/url]&&[b]TV favorites[/b]: (currently) Pushing Daisies, Chuck, Journeyman (cancelled! grrr...), Heroes&& all-time) 24, Stargate SG1, X-Files, Lost, House
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