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| 15 MAY 2003 at 9:33pm |
adventuredogGuild Master
Posts : 3255
Joined: 14 JAN 2003
Status : Offline | Dear Ragnar - Thank you for creating The Longest Journey. I enjoyed it immensely (one of my top three games) and have been looking forward to some sort of sequel ever since I finished the game. I loved the visuals and the gameplay. I also loved the fact that it is a PURE adventure - no timed action sequences, no twitchy mouse finger stuff.
I am very nervous and saddened to see that you appear to be going in another direction with the sequel, unless there was some miscommunication in the interview or writeup.
If this is true please tell us why. I loved TLJ as a pure adventure and would very much like the sequel to be in a similar style. Jazz up the graphics or whatever, but please don't make it an action adventure. I am playing TLJ again right now and am enjoying it all over again.
You have a lot of fans here. Please come and talk to us. We would love to hear from you.
P.S. If it will be an action adventure, then I am sorry, but I will not buy it much as I have been looking forward to the sequel. I do not enjoy them.
Still adventuring after all these years!
Patiently awaiting The Last Crown: Haunting of Hallowed Isle, and Bracken Tor...
... and Asylum if it's not tooooo scary...
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| 16 MAY 2003 at 11:58am |
KsandraSchattenjger
Posts : 2459
Joined: 2 APR 2003
Status : Online | Thanks Monkeybone for creating this thread.
Hi Ragnar,
Many of us are extremely worried about the news that TLJ 2 is going to be a 3D action-adventure. The reason adventure fans loved the original game so much was precisely because it was a traditional, 2D, point-and-click adventure with no combat whatsoever. The things that attracted us were the familiar style of gameplay, beautiful graphics, strong story and believable dialogue and characters. We were all delighted to see that there was someone out there who could still produce great adventure games.
Now, if the information we have is correct, Funcom has also declared the adventure game to be 'dead' and you are planning to turn the TLJ sequel into an action game. The ostensible reason for this is that it will attract a broader audience (presumably action fans). I think you are making a big mistake - action gamers are unlikely to be attracted to the game since it is the sequel to a pure adventure they won't have played, while the people who loved the original will be put off by the fact that the sequel contains action. I for one will not be willing to buy TLJ 2 if it is an action-adventure - I don't like this type of game and it would spoil my memories of the original TLJ.
Obviously, what you choose to do with TLJ 2 is your decision. But in the past you have listened to fans and responded to our concerns. I know there are many people who wish you would reconsider and at least make TLJ2 a pure adventure, even if it has to be in 3D. Please talk to us - we are all desperate to know what your plans are for the sequel we have looked forward to for so long.
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| 16 MAY 2003 at 12:47pm |
koalagreenIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 3
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Hey Ragnar,
If the new TLJ is an action adventure, I guess I won't be buying it. I enjoyed the original and as with many games the sequels were action adventure, and I did not buy them either. I do not want to fight and kill and maim, I just want to get into a good story and take all my troubles away.
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| 16 MAY 2003 at 10:07pm |
GayleSchattenjger
Posts : 2544
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Dear Ragnar,
Why????? TLJ is one of my very favorite games and is played again and again. The game sucks you in and you are lost when it ends, longing for more and now you are going to change it?
If the reason for the change is that you will capture a larger audience it maybe a double edged sword.
Those who are true adventure players and will not play anything with action will not buy TLJ2. Now, you may not realize it but all over this small world of ours there are thousands of those gamers. They will not buy your new game. Others who do play action games might buy your game but if they did not play the first one because it was an adventure may not buy this one, assuming it is still an adventure and dismiss it.
Either way, you are flipping a coin and you might lose.
Please, make it as the first game. on't alter a pattern that made that game one of the most outstanding games ever created by anyone.
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| 17 MAY 2003 at 7:19pm |
Jenny100Guild Master
Posts : 3510
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Here's a link to a newsgroup message on the subject of changing the genre of the TLJ name (archived at googlegroups)
http://makeashorterlink.com/?I51321B94
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| 17 MAY 2003 at 9:11pm |
jamarchandSchattenjger
Posts : 1665
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | FUNCOM MEMORIAL
[img]http://shopping.corbis.com/shared/images/67/10558477/SH001327.jpg[/img]
[size=24]R.I.P.
In the name of the Father, the Son and the Spirit Saint
"In Adventure we trust"
 &&&&[move]Actually playing SHIVERS and Rhem 2[/move]&&
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| 18 MAY 2003 at 1:11am |
Bob_the_BuilderJourneyman
Posts : 956
Joined: 25 APR 2003
Status : Online | Honestly, I'm still going to buy TLJ2 since I like action games as well but I think that the TLJ series should remain an adventure game series. If you want to games in the same universe and make them different types of games, that's fine, but at least change the title if this becomes an action game.
NO SOUP FOR YOU!
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 6:56am |
| Deleted User | BUMP!
Just to let people know, he does read this forum so keep stuff coming. A poll is good, but these are thoughts from fans so don't stop because the thread is getting old!
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 10:16am |
sennebecGuild Master
Posts : 3334
Joined: 15 NOV 2004
Location: US, maine
Status : Offline | turning tlj2 into action for the sake of reaching a larger audience, thus more $$$, is totally ridiculous...
first of all...if a person is into action games, they've probably never even heard of tlj... and once they find out that it was an adventure, they'd probably not be too interested in playing a sequel regardless of it being advertised as an action game...
and if they're anything like me regarding sequels, i like to play the entire series, starting with the first...
sooooo... what action gamer would be even faintly interested in playing the first tlj ? thus keeping tlj2 on the shelf...
second...i, as a somewhat adventure purist, will not touch tlj2 with a ten foot pole... so you've lost my money and i doubt that i am the only one who feels this way...
if i've said it once, i've said it a gazillion times...
i play adventures to unwind and escape from daily turmoil... do not give me anxiety-ridden action games
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 11:34am |
Steve IncePrivate Detective
Posts : 571
Joined: 7 NOV 2002
Status : Offline | Hey Ragnar, go for it. o what you feel you need to do to keep making the games.
Broken Sword - The Sleeping Dragon was very well received at E3 with both the graphics and the interface getting a really positive thumbs up.
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 11:59am |
dimidimidimiSchattenjger
Posts : 1784
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Of course it's Ragnar's game and he can do what he wants with it. But just for the record, if TLJ2 is an action/adventure I am not going to be buying it either. If it is a pure adventure then I'll be the first in the store when it comes over here.
Anyway if it's not a pure adventure I don't bother that much anymore. Legacy, Black Mirror, Jane's game and so many more will keep me busy for a while .
PDF adventure magazine - The Inventory&&http://www.justadventure.com/TheInventory/TheInventory.shtm&&&&What would you give to know the truth?&&http://www.brokensaints.com
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 12:05pm |
StammerGuild Master
Posts : 3894
Joined: 5 JAN 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By dimidimidimi (19 MAY 2003 11:59am)
Of course it's Ragnar's game and he can do what he wants with it. But just for the record, if TLJ2 is an action/adventure I am not going to be buying it either. If it is a pure adventure then I'll be the first in the store when it comes over here. I am with you! I don't want it an action/adventure!!! I want it just like the first one...
Resistance is not futile, we're gonna win this thing, humankind is too good, we're not a bunch of under-achievers! We're gonna stand up, and we're gonna be human beings. We're going to get fired up about the real things, the things that matter! Creativity, and the dynamic human spirit that refuses to submit.
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 12:22pm |
| Deleted User | I dunno if I'd want it just like the first one, but at least make it an adventure... Chuck in a more streamlined interface, more freedom, better graphics and whatnot, hell, make it 3D, but keep the essence of simplicity. That's why it sold so well.
:-/ If it's some third-person runarounder then I'm not so... well, into the idea.
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 5:17pm |
| Deleted User | Was just checkign to see if Ragnar had replied. But not yet. Is it really going to be action / adventure?
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 6:03pm |
nytimesguyPrivate Detective
Posts : 684
Joined: 14 OCT 2002
Status : Online | The problem with action/adventure games is they usually only do one well. Since I don't object to action in general I don't invariably object to action in adventures, but only if it is easy action whose purpose is more to create a sense of excitement than to actually challenge the player's eye-hand coordination. Ico is a good example of that. But I tend to think it's a mistake to even go that far in TLJ2. It's not so much that I object on the pricipal that pure adventure is better than action/adventure, although generally I think that's true, but that I feel it's like making a sequel to The Wizard of Oz in which Dorothy carries a shotgun (and yes, I know American McGee is doing just that and I'm quite looking forward to it, but McGee just makes twisted bloodfests and his games can't really be compared with Ragnar's). The first game was so perfect, and while I wouldn't want it to simply repeat itself, I would want it to have a similar sensibility. Think Harry Potter - each book feeling original but part of the whole of the series.
Charles - Game Theorist
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 6:51pm |
Armand1880Sorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 223
Joined: 14 OCT 2002
Status : Online | For Ragnar, I think its a case of, "Hell, They'll buy it and I'll make a lot of money, I don't really care whether they like it or not."
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 7:03pm |
Agustín CordesGuild Master
Posts : 5696
Joined: 23 OCT 2002
Location: AR, Buenos Aires
Status : Offline | The problem here (as I see it) is simple: TLJ2 will only exist provided it is an action/adventure game. I'm sure this is a restriction that Funcom imposed on Ragnar. Quit hoping for a pure adventure.
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 10:25pm |
| Deleted User | monkeybone, nytetimesguy, and a few others that were pretty rude back then, I hate to say I told you so but I TOLD YOU SO! I can't help but think "ah, now you're whining!!!"
As I'm checking my mailbox today I see an email from JA+ about a response to an old thread, so I was curious. And, WOW! Turns out RT screwed you over after all. I warned you, I tried explaining it but the silly aforementioned likes of you were too ignorant to listen.
Now, I do realize that my point was a bit lost in the midst of some harsh words back then (rudeness of some posters as well as Ragnar's promted me to respond in the same way), which I'll try to avoid this time, I'll keep it civil. BUT my point still stands -- the guy (Ragnar) is a hypocrate. He made a bunch of promises but in the end it's an action-adventure game after all. Hasn't he learned from the numerous articles here that when you make an action-adventure you neither please action nor adventure players, and turn off both most likely? Name a single action-adventure game that didn't suck? Exactly...
I've been catching up on dimi's "Inventory" magazine issues and really liked the interview with Bill Tiller in "Inventory 5 - March 2003" issue. He makes some great points, which I won't repeat here (you can read it yourself if you like). I think Ragnar should have a read through that interview, maybe he would learn something worthwhile.
So, he's basically making a sequel to TLJ for platforms (consoles) that never had a prequel on them in the first place, leave mouse control for PC version but still make it part action and part adventure to "reach a wider audience" as he put it. Wow, I guess that's never been done before and never failed. To reach action gamer audience there'd have to be quite a lot of action in the game. But even that probably wouldn't be enough for action gamers, while in the process turning off adventure gamers. Trying to kill two birds with one stone? HMM...
I may have sounded like I was overreacting back then but it makes my day to see that I was right. I rest my case, and you're welcome
PS Yes, this name has an extra "n" at the end but that's because I unregistered the old name to not receive any more emails about new posts on old threads (changing email in profile didn't stop this board's script from doing so for some reason).
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 10:28pm |
| Deleted User | I'm sure this is a restriction that Funcom imposed on Ragnar. Quit hoping for a pure adventure.
Well, if it is a restriction Funcom imposed then why doesn't Ragnar just openly admit it? Instead, he would drag on and on and on about why this style of game is so great and better, which were basically just excuses, IMO. At least the makers of Simon 3D admitted that it was either 3D or no publisher for them, which was cool and honest. I dunno, maybe he just doesn't want to sound like he's a puppet to Funcom's rules... Ah well, there are plenty of other adventure games on the horizon that look much better...
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 11:41pm |
adventuredogGuild Master
Posts : 3255
Joined: 14 JAN 2003
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Rael (19 MAY 2003 7:03pm)
The problem here (as I see it) is simple: TLJ2 will only exist provided it is an action/adventure game. I'm sure this is a restriction that Funcom imposed on Ragnar. Quit hoping for a pure adventure.
How do you know that Rael?
Still adventuring after all these years!
Patiently awaiting The Last Crown: Haunting of Hallowed Isle, and Bracken Tor...
... and Asylum if it's not tooooo scary...
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| 19 MAY 2003 at 11:51pm |
adventuredogGuild Master
Posts : 3255
Joined: 14 JAN 2003
Status : Offline | Dear Ragnar - Now that a previous thread has resurfaced, I noticed that you had asked us very nicely (?) for input back on January 22:
I thought I'd just drop by to say a quick hello ("Hello!", and to pretend that I really am I nice guy (I am) who listens to the adventure gamers out there (I do).
Now. TLJ 2. (Or, as we like to refer to it in-house: "TLJ Deux".) (Yes, we're pretentious.) (But we're not French.) (Not that there's anything wrong with that.)
What's your wish-list - features, improvements, additions, subtractions - for a sequel to "The Longest Journey"?
Anyone? Anyone?
Cheers,
Ragnar (Guy Who Worked on TLJ & Who Will Probably Work on TLJ 2)
So, we enthusiastically responded because WE LOVE TLJ! Then, you never responded to our input except to tersely give a reference to the etymology of the f-word.
I sent your blog site an email inviting you to visit this forum and view our comments and concerns. Please give us a reply. Thank you!
Still adventuring after all these years!
Patiently awaiting The Last Crown: Haunting of Hallowed Isle, and Bracken Tor...
... and Asylum if it's not tooooo scary...
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| 20 MAY 2003 at 1:19am |
vestrum_mattIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 2
Joined: 20 MAY 2003
Status : Online | There is a new post on ragnar tornquist's web page about the action-adventure issue.
http://www.ragnartornquist.com/thoughts.html
posted by Ragnar Tornquist at 02:04:
Oh,and regarding that whole "action-adventure" thing: it will be an adventure game, not an action game-but there will be a wider variety of interactions and puzzles-including some action. Some. Anything you hear and read about it now is likely to change. Including the name!
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| 20 MAY 2003 at 1:45am |
adventuredogGuild Master
Posts : 3255
Joined: 14 JAN 2003
Status : Offline | Thanks Vestrum - I missed that post on his site today. The "TBC" in the quote you posted was between two of his short posts and I belive just means TO BE CONTINUED, so you can remove it.
I am VERY happy that he is reiterating that it will be an adventure. Curious about what he means by SOME action. More curious about what he means by " Anything you hear and read about it now is likely to change" Even this?
Still adventuring after all these years!
Patiently awaiting The Last Crown: Haunting of Hallowed Isle, and Bracken Tor...
... and Asylum if it's not tooooo scary...
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| 20 MAY 2003 at 1:57am |
vestrum_mattIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 2
Joined: 20 MAY 2003
Status : Online | We can certainly hope so.
I realized what the tbc stood for about 15 minutes after I posted, but oh well.
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