Legend of Grimrock is an indie CRPG inspired by games such as Dungeon Master and Eye of the Beholder, with proper party creation and a grid/step based movement system. I've been following this game for a while now, and it will soon be released. Interestingely enough, GOG has it up for pre-order, which makes it the second game that GOG ever game that they actually have up for pre-order (The Witcher 2 is the first). 

And I can't have been the only one who thought of a certain robot when I read the name of the game for the first time. 

Looked interesting at first, until i saw that vid.

I'm afraid this rpg is too old-school for me.

Too much messing around with the interface and the lack of freedom to look around, quickly ruin the immersion for me.

That's basically the reason why i never really played and rpg before 2006.

This looks great. Eye of the Beholder is one of my favorites. And I will have to disagree with you markovnikov, pre-2000 RPGs are simply better - that's a fact ]

Well okay, nothing's a fact in gaming but I like them a lot more than the dumbed-down gameplay you get in modern games.

I pre-ordered it on gog, and one of the extras is pretty cute. It is a PDF for a graph paper with a few note lines at the top, for those who want to make their own maps (the game will give you the option to play with or without an automap system, and I guess the graph paper PDF is meant to flirt a bit with people who played CRPGs in the 80's, as some actually game with some graph paper for you to make your own maps on). 

And I'm in semi-agreement with Walsh. While there have been some outstanding CRPGs released in more recent years, I would like to see more "crunch" in them. While games have many advantages as far as storytelling goes (though Planescape still stands as the undefeated king of storytelling, to this day), from a gameplay point of view I often find myself preferring titles from the 90's (80's is often a bit too old school for me when it comes to CRPGs, and I just can't get into games like the early Wizardry titles, Bard's Tale or Wasteland). 

The game does by the way seem to have a really nice soundtrack, if the quality of the song in the trailer is anything to go by. 

*edit* And to make things better yet, the devs have said that they are interested in adding mod support to this game, and some people have voiced interest in re-creating classics like Eye of the Beholder and Dungeon Master using thhe Legend of Grimrock engine. 

I can understand that many gamers miss the old rpg elements. Developers sure are limiting character customizatiion

But I prefer a more 'dumbed down' interface.

I have been following the game with great interest for months now, and I'm very glad it's about to be released, with only a slight delay from initial estimates (it was expected sometime last November, but the devolopers rather candindly said that it both needed some extra polish, and that releasing an RPG at the same time as Skyrim could hurt sales, even though the target audience is obviously more niche).

Pity it finally comes at a time when even the very modest GOG preorder price is somewhat of an issue for me. Here's hoping I'll soon be compensated for months of yet unpaid work :s.

Originally Posted By markornikov (29 MAR 2012 9:35am)

I can understand that many gamers miss the old rpg elements. Developers sure are limiting character customizatiion

But I prefer a more 'dumbed down' interface.

I think that really is the key part, character customization. I like to be able to create my own characters, with plenty of options on how to actually do so (it does not have to be on the same level as Realms of Arkania, but I would at least like to go back to an AD&D level of character customization). Overall I don't think the interface in Legend of Grimrock look all that intimidating, but I can understand why people dislike the grid/step based gameplay. That particular design choice has spurred quite a debate, some hate it, some love it, some think any game using a system like this should be turn based, some think its fine for it to be real time. One thing is certain though, it is a polarizing design choice.

Originally Posted By Mr Innocent. (29 MAR 2012 10:50am)

Pity it finally comes at a time when even the very modest GOG preorder price is somewhat of an issue for me. Here's hoping I'll soon be compensated for months of yet unpaid work :s.

That is horrible. Has the situation not normalized enough in Greece for companies/the government to actually pay their workers? The local press has almost stopped reporting about the situation down there, which gave the impression that things were at least getting more stable. 

I've been reading the manual for Legend of Grimrock, and it does not look nearly as intimidating as Wizardry. You only have 4 races (Human, Minotaur, Lizardman, Insectoid) and 3 classes (Fighter, Rogue, Mage), but there seem to be a fair amount of possible customization within the classes.

And I'm actually finding myself more excited over this game than I was for Skyrim.

My disposable income is about zero with little chance of improvement in the foreseeable future, but at least I'm one of the few lucky ones that are not in debt. And if even one of my prospective clients decides to close a deal, I'll be able to keep my business floating for 2012. Don't pay me any mind, me complaining that I no longer have the cash to add to the skyscraper-high pile of unplayed games is rather callous when the vast bulk of Greek middle class families can no longer make ends meet and are in danger of losing their homes 

As for Greek economy being stable, you are right. Death, after all, is an extremely stable state, more so when attempts at resuscitation come in the form of administering large doses of heroin. But let's not start this conversation, it will quickly turn into politics, something wisely banned in these forums IMHO.

Yes, probably a good idea to not go deeper into that. I just got the impression from my local media that things were getting better again. 

Welll... to me DA  :   O has enough customization options and complexity and gameplay options to make it the perfect RPG gameplay-wise for me.  And  it feels immersive enough.  If I want to play hex-based games, I prefer TBS games like HOMM and Disciples.

So... hmm, not sure if this is the perfect answer for me.

Why would you bring up DA: O on an actual RPG topic?

You obviously haven't played the real DA  :  O   you've probably been too busy playing action-RPG's like Diablo...  

There are fake versions of DA: O? There is one that isn't an action RPG with repetitive and uninspired combat?

I have yet to play DA: O, but I'm really confused by the opposing characterizations of the game I keep reading about, much like I'm seeing here. Is it an homage to Baldur's Gate as advertised, or not? Best I just play it and decide for myself, I suppose.

I don't know what Juice Mr Innocent is drinking but DA

The combat can be paused (in fact you'll need to do that on the harder difficulty), you can issue orders to your party members, set up traps, spells can do friendly fire, etc.

IT's very much a tactical combat system that you can pause, just like BG.

It's no where near "action-rpg" combat, like Skyrim, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc.

Great charactres, good writing, very "epic aventure" feeling to it's story and world, one of my favorite rpgs in a long time.

DAII though, stay far far away.

This Legend of Grimrock looks interesting, like a newer Eye of the Beholder/Stonekeep.

Originally Posted By Stiler (31 MAR 2012 6:38pm)

I don't know what Juice Mr Innocent is drinking but DA

(not DAII) is very much a Baldur's Gate type of rpg. In fact I'd say ti's about the closest game to it that I've played in the past decade.

 

The combat can be paused (in fact you'll need to do that on the harder difficulty), you can issue orders to your party members, set up traps, spells can do friendly fire, etc.

 

IT's very much a tactical combat system that you can pause, just like BG.

 

It's no where near "action-rpg" combat, like Skyrim, Kingdoms of Amalur, etc.

 

Great charactres, good writing, very "epic aventure" feeling to it's story and world, one of my favorite rpgs in a long time.

 

DAII though, stay far far away.

 

Yes, that. 

Mr Innocent 's previous screen name used to NikOFS ; - do you remember him?  He's the ActionRPG lover, the one who who is such a big Diablo fan.  So  I doubt he ever even played DA : O but he knows I love the game, and he loves teasing me and just generally stirring the pot.   

Yes, the gameplay is very customizable, you can choose if you want to go real-time and let the AI do everything for all of your characters except your player characer, of if you want to pre-program them yourself and still let them go realtime with the AI you had pre-set, or you can micromanage them and do turn-based very much like with  Drakensang.  So you can choose if you want it to be actiony or if you want to micromanage, the latter being the mode I prefer.

It's DA:2 that was sadly very dumbed down in every respect, inlcuding character building choices, but also with much more actiony type combat wich has less choices.  Sort of a Dragon Age for idiots.   

Btw, I might have managed to get hold of a copy of Kingdoms of Amalur.

Originally Posted By Traveller (1 APR 2012 7:52am)

 

It's DA:2 that was sadly very dumbed down in every respect, inlcuding character building choices, but also with much more actiony type combat wich has less choices.  Sort of a Dragon Age for idiots.   

Why they make such development choices is beyond me, one can choose to let the game automatically choose for you with the auto-level up system. So why ruin the experience for die-hard RPG fans?

Originally Posted By markornikov (1 APR 2012 11:13am)

Originally Posted By Traveller (1 APR 2012 7:52am)

 

It's DA:2 that was sadly very dumbed down in every respect, inlcuding character building choices, but also with much more actiony type combat wich has less choices.  Sort of a Dragon Age for idiots.   

 

Why they make such development choices is beyond me, one can choose to let the game automatically choose for you with the auto-level up system. So why ruin the experience for die-hard RPG fans?

  

Exactly, why not just have a wide range of difficulty like they did with DA :  O?

 Admittedly DA :  O  was considered a bit too  "difficult" directly after release, but then they did release a patch that made the Easy and Very Easy levels easier.  I started the game on medium, and then started picking up problems in that tower after you do the chapter with the Koscarii Wilds.   I sort of died a few times against that Ogre troll  whatever thing there, so to beat that thing I put the game at it's easiest level.  Then I played a bit on at that level, but after I applied the "easy" patch, suddenly the game was much too easy for me on easy, and I had to go at least one level up.

 After that, I'd consider the game perfect,  combatwise, as you know. 

Originally Posted By markornikov (1 APR 2012 11:13am)

 

 

Why they make such development choices is beyond me, one can choose to let the game automatically choose for you with the auto-level up system. So why ruin the experience for die-hard RPG fans?

 

 

 

Consolification, really. Menus are annoying to navigate on a console. I really did not mind the skill trees though, they just should have expanded a bit further on it.

With Dragon Age 1, they created 2 different versions, one that was console friendly and one that was more PC-oriented (most reviewers did by the way praise the PC version more than the console version). Porting a console game over to PC is quite doable, there are no console-controls (on a regular gamepad) that won't work on a PC, in a worst case scenario you might need a gamepad  but that it is about it, doing it the other way around is a lot harder though, and considering how rushed DA2 was in general, it is no surprise that they decided to just port over the console version with no real changes to the game.

And for a mainstream CRPG, Dragon Age: origins really is the closest thing to a silver age CRPG that we have seen in age. I still think that Baldur's Gate and its ilk have a better rule system, but at least Dragon Age gave you some interesting tactical and strategic options (even if game balance was a bit off. And parts of the game did feel a bit unfinished). 

And I just realized that if I work hard this week, then I'll be able to take the Wednesday-Friday off next week, so I can live in front of Grimrock! 

TotalBiscuit has released a WTF video for Grimrock. The devs warn for some minor spoiler in this video, in regards to how to solve some early puzzles. I'm just listening to it, for the most part. This guy is often quite honest about what he thinks about different games, and he seem to have very little bad to say about Grimrock, in fact he seem to love it, which is a very good sign:

And ElderGeek also talks about the game. Less spoilers in this one. They absolutely love the game, and while they could find a handful of negative things to say, they also make it very clear that these were very small in comparison to how great the game is overall. They really praised the games puzzles.

Dammit Fnord! I'm not watching any more spoiler videos :|

I can't wait for LoG, it's one of my most anticipated of the year. I don't think there has been any non-action RPGs since Neverwinter Nights.

The second video is very low on spoilers. They won't show anything new and of interest that the trailer video has not already shown.

There have been a few non-action CRPGs released in more recent years, though the vast majority of them have been indie titles. Check out theIndie fort bundle if you want a really "hard core" game. Devil Whiskey is apparently more akin to Bard's Tale than anything modern. Though that game is not exactly new, the developers have, just a few months ago, released another game similar to it. 

Other prominent recent releases include: Frayed Knights (Wizardry-like, sadly without any real character creation, but the character customization more than makes up for that), Eschalon (turnbased isometric), and the many games released by Spiderweb software (turnbased isometric as well). Also, we have seen a resurgence of rogue-likes in more recent times, with the surprisingly good entry level game "Dungeons of Dredmor" probably being the most popular of the lot (I don't even want to think about how many hours I've spent on that game, it is very fun though). 

And a classic review for Legends of Grimrock. With written words and stuff.

Ok, this looks too much like the games I enjoy and no one seems to make any more (although Frayed Knights also looks promising) for me to pass on. Tight my budget may be, but 10 euros is a couple of damn beers, and not the good stuff either. I'll pre-order it as soon as I can put some money in my debit card, probably Monday.

Originally Posted By Fnord (5 APR 2012 6:12am)

The second video is very low on spoilers. They won't show anything new and of interest that the trailer video has not already shown.

 

There have been a few non-action CRPGs released in more recent years, though the vast majority of them have been indie titles. Check out theIndie fort bundle if you want a really "hard core" game. Devil Whiskey is apparently more akin to Bard's Tale than anything modern. Though that game is not exactly new, the developers have, just a few months ago, released another game similar to it. 

Other prominent recent releases include: Frayed Knights (Wizardry-like, sadly without any real character creation, but the character customization more than makes up for that), Eschalon (turnbased isometric), and the many games released by Spiderweb software (turnbased isometric as well). Also, we have seen a resurgence of rogue-likes in more recent times, with the surprisingly good entry level game "Dungeons of Dredmor" probably being the most popular of the lot (I don't even want to think about how many hours I've spent on that game, it is very fun though). 

Thanks for that. Yes, indie RPGs have never seemed to do much for me. I've played Dungeons of Dredmor but I just don't think I'm into rogue-type games. I do like a bit of polish even if I shy away from too much of it.

Those that I mentioned are quite polished. There are also plenty of indie RPGs that lacks the polish of the above mentioned, but those are some of the real highlights of the genre.