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| 21 NOV 2010 at 8:02pm |
AndromusGuild Master
Posts : 5537
Joined: 6 NOV 2002
Status : Offline | My, what a load of...ahem. I never understood the level of vitriol Myst inspires in a certain segment of gamers. Or why it has to be the whipping boy for the problems of the adventure genre.
Anyway, I'm not sure what game Mr. Walker was playing, but it sure didn't sound like Myst. Myst (save perhaps for the underground tram) was neither disorienting or particularly confusing in what you had to do to solve its puzzles.
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| 21 NOV 2010 at 9:02pm |
IviniaGuild Master
Posts : 4459
Joined: 7 JUN 2003
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Andromus (21 NOV 2010 8:02pm)
Anyway, I'm not sure what game Mr. Walker was playing, but it sure didn't sound like Myst.
That's because those that bash on the game have never played it. They might have attempted a few tries and walked away thinking it was more difficult than it really was. I know I did, until I resolved to play it all the way through. There wasn't anything like the author was swearing that was in the game.
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| 21 NOV 2010 at 9:50pm |
Lady KestrelGuild Master
Posts : 4036
Joined: 27 SEP 2004
Location: US, NJ
Status : Offline | He's obviously a puzzle-challenged individual with a poor sense of direction and the attention span of a gnat combined with very poor taste in his choice of gaming platform.
"Where is the fountain that throws up these flowers in a ceaseless outbreak of ecstasy?"
-Rabindranath Tagore
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| 21 NOV 2010 at 10:04pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4940
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Sounds like he's been carrying around this burden for some time. Poor fellow- all those years of agony over how Myst screwed everybody and everything related to gaming forever. Perhaps he would have had even a modicum of credibility on the issue if the Myst 'series' had stopped at the first game. But, silly us, we continued to buy all the rest of the games in the series in record amounts.
And btw, speaking of credibility, 7th Guest can hardly be considered 'the cousin' of Myst. Considering the release dates and characteristics of each game, 7th Guest should be considered more like the 'uncle' of Myst.
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 21 NOV 2010 at 10:32pm |
CarolineJA+ Overseer
Posts : 16540
Joined: 28 JAN 2007
Location: AU
Status : Offline | Well I laughed all the way through that article. I thought it was very witty and well written. He declared his non-serious intention in the very opening lines: 'I blame Myst'. Then he goes on to state all the things he blames Myst for including the Iraq War.
And I particularly liked his venomous spitting at how mechanical puzzles have clues scattered 15 minutes away ..... [smiley=rofl.gif]
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| 21 NOV 2010 at 10:38pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4940
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Caroline (21 NOV 2010 10:32pm)
Well I laughed all the way through that article. I thought it was very witty and well written. He declared his non-serious intention in the very opening lines: 'I blame Myst'. Then he goes on to state all the things he blames Myst for including the Iraq War.
So Myst wasn't the cause of the Iraq war?
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 12:58am |
Jenny100Guild Master
Posts : 3510
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Seems like beating on a dead potato to me.
For some people it never gets old, but for me it was a sad attempt at humor in the first place and gets no better on the rehash.
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 9:38am |
CulturaJourneyman
Posts : 1337
Joined: 1 SEP 2004
Location: NL, Amersfoort
Status : Offline | I think it is very funny. And has some truth in it as well. (and that's from a avid Myst fan)
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 11:08am |
IviniaGuild Master
Posts : 4459
Joined: 7 JUN 2003
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Cultura (22 NOV 2010 9:38am)
I think it is very funny. And has some truth in it as well. (and that's from a avid Myst fan)
That's it. Now you've done it and gone there.
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 11:43am |
CulturaJourneyman
Posts : 1337
Joined: 1 SEP 2004
Location: NL, Amersfoort
Status : Offline | :'(
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 10:50pm |
karlaAdministrator
Posts : 2588
Joined: 27 JUL 2003
Location: US, Close to the Edge
Status : Offline | I hope I don't sound too blasphemous when I say that I'm with Caroline and Cultura. I think the article is hilarious! And I agree with Cultura that there's truth to some of it.
My main problem with the original Myst was navigation. It was the first 1st-person node-based slide-show AG I ever played. And I did get disoriented. Repeatedly. Throughout the game. Particularly, as I recall, in Channelwood Age.
But I forged ahead. I took pages and pages of notes. I said many bad words. I wondered if maybe there were two games called Myst and I was playing the wrong one.
By the time I reached the end, I didn't quite know what to think. The game wore me out. And while I did enjoy parts of it, I couldn't understand what all the fuss was about.
So I put it away and tried to stick with AGs that wouldn't assault my sense of direction so badly.
I've played Myst again several times since then, and I've come to appreciate its attraction. But I'll tell you something: I didn't thoroughly enjoy it until I got my hands on realMyst. That made all the difference to me. It opened everything up. I could actuually tell where I was going! I loved it. I still do.
Now please excuse me...I must search for a way out of here that hopefully won't involve getting lost and/or colliding with solid objects...
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 10:53pm |
SirDaveGuild Master
Posts : 4940
Joined: 17 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Mods, could you please remove the post just above...
The future ain't what it used to be!
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 10:56pm |
karlaAdministrator
Posts : 2588
Joined: 27 JUL 2003
Location: US, Close to the Edge
Status : Offline | Waaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh!!!
[smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif] [smiley=cry.gif]
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| 22 NOV 2010 at 11:54pm |
HalcyonSchattenjger
Posts : 1652
Joined: 17 NOV 2006
Status : Offline | I've missed Myst, which leaves me pissed and, in fact, dissed, I hissed.
There's a thread connecting a certain part of every Myst fan's heart and head. When you open a book and instead of words you find worlds, this is a life-changing moment. It stuns you, surprises you, and feels not much like a game, but all-too-real.
It doesn't matter which Myst game you begin with. Once you're in the world, you belong to it and it to you. This separates you from other gamers who are only utilizing their imaginations.
Of course you'll be loathed. People hate things they don't understand, especially if someone else is enjoying it.
Pity those without Myst. And pity those who have discovered it, as well, for they can never leave.
_________________
Exercise your vision.
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| 23 NOV 2010 at 7:14am |
TravellerGuild Master
Posts : 4039
Joined: 3 JUL 2010
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By karla (22 NOV 2010 10:50pm)
.
I've played Myst again several times since then, and I've come to appreciate its attraction. But I'll tell you something: I didn't thoroughly enjoy it until I got my hands on realMyst. That made all the difference to me. It opened everything up. I could actuually tell where I was going! I loved it. I still do.
/me trots off to GOG to get RealMyst.
Hopefully this time I won't get RealPyst too. I started Myst a few times but never had the pleasure of finishing it. :-[
EDIT: Got it! It's downloading now. Wow, buying something from GOG literally takes seconds! What a pleasure! 8-)
* * * Just call me Trav. * * *
“Despite my ghoulish reputation, I really have the heart of a small boy. I keep it in a jar on my desk.” - Robert Bloch
"They are not reciprocally sublated--the one does not sublate the other externally--but each sublates itself in itself and is in its own self the opposite of itself" (Hegel, from The Doctrine of Being)..."
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| 23 NOV 2010 at 8:05pm |
MrLipidPrivate Detective
Posts : 666
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Do let us know what you think. The only way I finished MYST was by playing realMYST through and then going back to the original. 3D makes a big difference in navigation.
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| 23 NOV 2010 at 9:46pm |
InlandAZGuild Master
Posts : 5586
Joined: 4 MAY 2007
Status : Offline | +1 more for RealMyst
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| 23 NOV 2010 at 10:36pm |
CarolineJA+ Overseer
Posts : 16540
Joined: 28 JAN 2007
Location: AU
Status : Offline | Being only the second game I played, Myst remains for me total magic. I can still remember how excited I felt when I raised the ship and then how trapped I felt when I entered the real ship only to find I couldn't leave until I solved the damn puzzles.
That game seduced my brain. I played RealMyst last year and found it to be cartoonish compared to the original. However I think what I was looking for was the excitement I'd felt first time round and it simply wasn't there because I already knew the puzzle solutions.
However, after being immersed in Uruonline for months now, I found myself getting annoyed while replaying Riven recently because I couldn't turn freely. So I guess I've been spoilt now.
Let us know how you enjoy the game Trav.
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| 24 NOV 2010 at 9:01pm |
CrisGerSchattenjger
Posts : 2539
Joined: 28 APR 2007
Location: US
Status : Offline | Glad you got RM Trav, it is a lot of fun and very beatufiul. a whole new look to Myst.
That fellow i think was just grandstanding using a well known name game to make his own name. Sad, ..he really missed the point about everything that is good about Myst. Ah well, not even worth registering on that site to post a comment.
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3D Worlds and Game Developers
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| 24 NOV 2010 at 9:49pm |
karlaAdministrator
Posts : 2588
Joined: 27 JUL 2003
Location: US, Close to the Edge
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By placeholder (23 NOV 2010 7:14am)
Originally Posted By karla (22 NOV 2010 10:50pm)
.
I've played Myst again several times since then, and I've come to appreciate its attraction. But I'll tell you something: I didn't thoroughly enjoy it until I got my hands on realMyst. That made all the difference to me. It opened everything up. I could actuually tell where I was going! I loved it. I still do.
/me trots off to GOG to get RealMyst.
Hopefully this time I won't get RealPyst too. I started Myst a few times but never had the pleasure of finishing it. :-[
EDIT: Got it! It's downloading now. Wow, buying something from GOG literally takes seconds! What a pleasure! 8-)
I got mine from GOG too, Trav. I'd wanted it, literally, for years.
I'd played the demo, but the game was no longer available -- at least I couldn't find it, and I looked everywhere. When I saw that GOG had it I immediately pounced on it.
I hope you enjoy it as much as I have.
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| 24 NOV 2010 at 10:26pm |
BrianSpace Cadet
Posts : 117
Joined: 28 SEP 2010
Status : Offline | It is worth noting that someone playing Myst now, for the first time, years after it created a standard for other games to be measured by, is going to be nothing like playing it when it was one of a kind. It's much easier to see its flaws when you've already been introduced to so many games that had the chance to learn from its mistakes.
I found it interesting to compare Myst with Zork, the original Infocom text adventure. They were both amazing games at the time that they were introduced, and expanded the imaginations of a generation of game-makers. But they also fell into some of the same traps.
For one, they both seem driven to introduce you to as broad a range of environments as possible, at the expense of establishing a thematic consistency. (You're in a basement. Now you're in a dungeon! Now you're standing on a dam! Or: You're on an island! Now you're on a completely unrelated island! Now you're on a set of floating catwalks!) When you've never played a game like this before, it's enchanting and addicting. When you've played lots of games like this before, it can seem arbitrary and amateurish.
Myst also falls short in the internal logic department. I mean, who hides a book by stowing it inside a ship, and then makes it so the entire ship can be raised and sunk by a mechanism? Who engraves their passwords on a stone wall with a chisel? Why would one store a library on an island with no bedroom, no kitchen, not even a desk to sit down at? Again, these are nitpicky complaints when the entire genre is new to you. But look how much more attention was paid to internal logic in Riven. Almost all the puzzles you have to solve have an explanation for why they are there. (They're a result of Gehn's jury-rigged method of making books, for example, or they're because Gehn and the Moiety are engaged in a battle of secrets.)
Nothing groundbreaking stands up quite as well when you compare it to its followers.
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| 25 NOV 2010 at 1:46am |
Igor HardyIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 67
Joined: 27 SEP 2010
Status : Online | Originally Posted By breadbox (24 NOV 2010 10:26pm)
I found it interesting to compare Myst with Zork, the original Infocom text adventure. They were both amazing games at the time that they were introduced, and expanded the imaginations of a generation of game-makers. But they also fell into some of the same traps.
For one, they both seem driven to introduce you to as broad a range of environments as possible, at the expense of establishing a thematic consistency. (You're in a basement. Now you're in a dungeon! Now you're standing on a dam! Or: You're on an island! Now you're on a completely unrelated island! Now you're on a set of floating catwalks!) When you've never played a game like this before, it's enchanting and addicting. When you've played lots of games like this before, it can seem arbitrary and amateurish.
Myst also falls short in the internal logic department. I mean, who hides a book by stowing it inside a ship, and then makes it so the entire ship can be raised and sunk by a mechanism? Who engraves their passwords on a stone wall with a chisel? Why would one store a library on an island with no bedroom, no kitchen, not even a desk to sit down at? Again, these are nitpicky complaints when the entire genre is new to you. But look how much more attention was paid to internal logic in Riven. Almost all the puzzles you have to solve have an explanation for why they are there. (They're a result of Gehn's jury-rigged method of making books, for example, or they're because Gehn and the Moiety are engaged in a battle of secrets.)
I doubt Myst creators unwittingly "fell into some of the same traps" doing things the way they did - there's a certain beauty about how these "inconsistencies of internal logic" have been introduced. Myst was always marketed as a surreal experience and this is a great part of its appeal. It's why the Myst island feels so myst-erious and intriguing. So for example, while The 7th Guest (released around the same time) possibly had better graphics than Myst, it couldn't match up to its feel and iconic look.
Covering independent adventure games in [URL=http://hardydev.com/][B]A Hardy Developer's Journal[/B][/URL]
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| 25 NOV 2010 at 5:21am |
| Deleted User | GOG offers both Myst Masterpice Edition and RealMyst both at the same price. Hah GOG, I'm no fool, I know what I want, I want to be able to see everything this classic game has to offer. I have to regress as I purchasd the original game many many years ago and just shook my head getting lost.... but in truth I was expecting something different. But now with RealMyst I can just start out and journey about and count controll switches... so much easier and enjoyable, at least for starters.
Just wanted to mention from my own personal experience and seeing that although GOG states that the game is compatible with the most current operating systems it doesn't work all that well (for Vista in my case) unless you make a few changes and run it with WinXP SP2 compatabily mode. Other forums agree. Enjoy.
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| 25 NOV 2010 at 7:54am |
TravellerGuild Master
Posts : 4039
Joined: 3 JUL 2010
Location: US
Status : Offline | I haven't really had a chance to play yet, just started it and 'tested' it, but yeah, being able to actually "walk" in Myst was such a pleasure that I crowed in glee! I actually prefer the original pre-rendered backgrounds and textures of the original Myst, but hey, its' a small price to pay not to have that unnatural node navigation.
..and talking of first experiences.. well, I only discovered Myst around 2000 - 2001, along with Space Quest 4. My only previous experience with adventure games had been the King's Quest games. In those games it had been relatively obvious what you had to do next..- not easy, but you knew what your goal was, if not what the means to reach it was. (Which was at least relatively easy to figure out, even if you had to draw maps, navigate through mazes, and figure out riddles.)
In Myst and SQ4, I was totally lost. Admittedly I was more lost in SQ4 than I was in Myst, but it just wasn't obvious what you had to do, so I simply quitted SQ4, and I wandered around aimlessly in Myst's initial age for a long time... :'(
I think I only managed to visit one other (ok, possibly 2 other ages) in the end.
Ah, the trauma still simmers under the surface.... - perhaps I can redeem the damage done with this...this RealMyst. :
(...and after that, I'm tackling the Space Quest series. I'll be using UHS this time, if necessary. ) Um, for SQ that is, not for Myst. For Myst, I'll probably just get Pyst again, ho-hum!
Talking of Space Quest - now you know why I hate plungers, especially intergalactic ones...
* * * Just call me Trav. * * *
“Despite my ghoulish reputation, I really have the heart of a small boy. I keep it in a jar on my desk.” - Robert Bloch
"They are not reciprocally sublated--the one does not sublate the other externally--but each sublates itself in itself and is in its own self the opposite of itself" (Hegel, from The Doctrine of Being)..."
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