| 30 MAY 2008 at 2:49pm |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | I never liked King's Quests or Space Quests as well as Police Quests.
I also never liked Grim Fandango or Monkey Island 4
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 3:54pm |
InlandAZGuild Master
Posts : 5587
Joined: 4 MAY 2007
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Ivinia (30 MAY 2008 2:30pm)
This months issue of PC Gamer has an editorial on adventure games. The writer has apparently written for AdventureGamers and designed 15 of the things, so this isn't an article from some mainstream mag outsider who "doesn't get it" ripping on the genre.
Name? (better not be Osborn)...
What ever became of him by the way, there was a day when he'd drop a post from time to time.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 3:54pm |
avatar_58Private Detective
Posts : 403
Joined: 27 MAY 2008
Status : Online | I will never understand the side takers. I like both. I prefer Sierra however - because even though Lucasarts games were far more polished and planned (no dead ends or timer bugs) I just felt like Sierra created more "games" while Lucasarts spent more time with the story portion.
Sierra spent a good amount of time making YOU solve everything. They didn't hand you anything but a few clues and the means to explore your surroundings. Only later in their years did they start to mirror Lucasarts, though still on the "figure it out" side of things.
For instance - Space Quest 5. Many casual gamers would be stuck right off the bat when shoved into the scow. If you ask Flo she sayd where you need to be. Yet most would give up because it's not handed to them on a plate. Then the android scene. That fight was great, and yet it required some thinking (and the entire solution was given earlier in the game, if you paid attention). Thats how I like it - make the player think and be aware.
Then we have Gabriel Knight. A game with excellent story, excellent puzzles and full environmental interaction. You can examine everything and many conversation topics, while interesting, are optional. You also cannot miss anything as you can travel back. There are NO hotspots for help, you figure it out. This is the perfect adventure game frame to me, and I wish more games paid attention.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:05pm |
IviniaGuild Master
Posts : 4459
Joined: 7 JUN 2003
Location: US
Status : Offline | Yatzee Croshaw. Never heard of him. Apparently he is one of those underground developers who puts out those freeware games using AGS. The one I had heard of was 7 Days a Skeptic. Not that the article is from some big name adventure developer, but he is obviously a fan of the genre - enough to create his own games, freeware or otherwise.
It's funny though. This has gotten me on a bit of a research kick at the moment and digging up blogs about what will save the genre so to speak. It's a bit humorous. Everyone has their opinions and they all conflict with each other. One in particular sounded dreadfully boring to me and the reason I really dislike certain games. It's about midway down this page: http://guildwriter.wordpress.com/2007/02/
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:15pm |
Mr Innocent.Journeyman
Posts : 1317
Joined: 15 JAN 2008
Location: GR
Status : Offline | You've never heard of Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw? His Zero Punctuation movie maker reviews over at the Escapist have already attained cult status. Good for him, but he is a total sell-out as far as adventure games are concerned, jumping on the "adventure games are dead" bandwagon as soon as he became part of a major gaming site (the days the Escapist had the best-written, most thought-provoking gaming related articles are sadly long gone). His Zack and Wiki review aptly demonstrates this. So don't take anything he has to say regarding adventure games too seriously...
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:26pm |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | oh man, this guy is awesome and spot on the Witcher
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/22-The-Witcher
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:33pm |
avatar_58Private Detective
Posts : 403
Joined: 27 MAY 2008
Status : Online | Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 4:26pm)
oh man, this guy is awesome and spot on the Witcher
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/22-The-Witcher
Not really. He's overrated and enjoyed by the masses who can't form their own opinions. The demo for the Witcher (chapter 1) is easily the weakest part of the game. He didn't give it a chance. He even admits this. He then goes on to say the game is too complex with the potions and too brainless with the combat.
What he failed to realize is the combat is timing based, not diablo style. The potions are described in full IN game, not in the manual. Unless you cannot read you should have no issues with them.
He is not an RPG fan thats why. He is ragging on a game which is in a genre he openly admits to despising. Of course he hates it.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:43pm |
Mr Innocent.Journeyman
Posts : 1317
Joined: 15 JAN 2008
Location: GR
Status : Offline | True, though it is not surprising. He was constantly pestered to review The Witcher even though by his own admission he doesn't like Rpgs and would never have played it by choice, both by fanboys who thought that this gem couldn't help but change his mind, and by detractors looking for some validation in their miserable little lives by having the latest internet sensation agree with them.
Still, I frequently laugh while watching his reviews, and I happen to think that his trademark bashing of much-hyped games is actually far more useful and to the point than the parade of "10/10" "five stars" "101%" scores that major gaming sites shower them with....
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:43pm |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | I am an RPG fan and I hated Witcher, and agree with almost everything he said about it.
he is also spot on the MOH Airborne http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/12-MOH-Airborne which I just beat using god mode.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 4:46pm |
avatar_58Private Detective
Posts : 403
Joined: 27 MAY 2008
Status : Online | Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 4:42pm)
I am an RPG fan and I hated Witcher, and agree with almost everything he said about it.
I liked the Witcher because it wasn't your average souless cookie cutter like Oblivion. The plot was interested and was affected by my choices, and there were many interesting characters, not just all signposts.
edited to remove epic head smacking mistake
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 7:06pm |
Lucien21Guild Master
Posts : 4876
Joined: 9 JUL 2003
Location: 0
Status : Offline | I would take anything he says with a mountain of salt.
He is a professional cynic. His "reviews" are overly negative. They occassionally make decent points, but he is too busy nit picking on any slight bad points to take seriously.
Dear Diary, My teenage angst bullsh*t now has a bodycount.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 7:27pm |
papillonSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 340
Joined: 3 JUL 2003
Status : Online | Take anything *anyone* says with a mountain of salt - anyone who thinks there's such a thing as an objective review when it comes to entertainment is kidding themselves. If you want to know about thing X, you should at least find someone who loves it and find out why, and someone who hates it and find out why.
I enjoy ZP reviews for their entertainment value even though his idea of what makes a good game is generally way off mine. He still sometimes has valid points, and it's worthwhile to take in a range of opinions.
[url=http://whineaboutgames.blogspot.com]I Whine About Games[/url]&&&&[url=http://www.hanakogames.com]Anime Games[/url]
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 8:13pm |
InlandAZGuild Master
Posts : 5587
Joined: 4 MAY 2007
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By Lucien21 (30 MAY 2008 7:05pm)
I would take anything he says with a mountain of salt.
He is a professional cynic. His "reviews" are overly negative. They occassionally make decent points, but he is too busy nit picking on any slight bad points to take seriously.
I guess he deserves a spot on my ignore list (I mean why bother if that's all he does).
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 8:28pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 4:26pm)
oh man, this guy is awesome and spot on the Witcher
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/22-The-Witcher
You know what, I don't think anything this brainless (by his own admission) person utters is even worth using as toilet paper.
I got The Witcher the day it came out, and sailed through it in less than a week without even looking at the printed manual once, and I'm no Einstein.
One cannot help but wonder if the reason for his narration, as opposed to text, is that the same insurmountable intellectual obstacles that prevented him from mastering Ch.2 of The Witcher, did not also prevent his education to progress to the point where he had actually mastered the Alphabet.....
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 9:56pm |
IviniaGuild Master
Posts : 4459
Joined: 7 JUN 2003
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By nik2008ofs (30 MAY 2008 4:14pm)
You've never heard of Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw?
Ohhh.... he's the guy that does those? I've seen them before, but never paid attention to the name of the person doing them.
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| 30 MAY 2008 at 11:11pm |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | Originally Posted By TheTraveler (30 MAY 2008 8:28pm)
Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 4:26pm)
oh man, this guy is awesome and spot on the Witcher
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/22-The-Witcher
You know what, I don't think anything this brainless (by his own admission) person utters is even worth using as toilet paper.
I got The Witcher the day it came out, and sailed through it in less than a week without even looking at the printed manual once, and I'm no Einstein.
One cannot help but wonder if the reason for his narration, as opposed to text, is that the same insurmountable intellectual obstacles that prevented him from mastering Ch.2 of The Witcher, did not also prevent his education to progress to the point where he had actually mastered the Alphabet.....
I agree, you don't really need a manual to fihure it out, but he is right about the story it bored the hell out of me and I couldn't care less about it. I hated the main character, I hated the combat and I hated the interface and all those skills/perks that all look similar. The Witcher is insanely overrated game.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 12:15am |
JKingSchattenjger
Posts : 2350
Joined: 4 MAY 2008
Location: 0
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By TheTraveler (30 MAY 2008 8:28pm)
One cannot help but wonder if the reason for his narration, as opposed to text, is that the same insurmountable intellectual obstacles that prevented him from mastering Ch.2 of The Witcher, did not also prevent his education to progress to the point where he had actually mastered the Alphabet.....
I rather question his motives behind delivering his narratives with such speed, personally. The first of them I listened to was amusing, but as I listened to a few more it quickly became obvious to me he was speaking so quickly to consciously mask the fact that none of his analyses ever stand up. Certainly if his "reviews" were rendered as text (or slower voice) which others could dissect at their leisure, I suspect he would quickly become a laughingstock---more so than is already the case, that is.
You can't kill someone in a studio.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 6:14am |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | and on top of that it is more entertaining, funny and saves time. While he is overexaggerating I thought he was pretty much spot on on at least 3 games that I played. And so I decided not to view the videos of several games that I plan to play so he doesn't ruin them for me or point out their flaws.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 8:26am |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 11:11pm)
Originally Posted By TheTraveler (30 MAY 2008 8:28pm)
Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 4:26pm)
oh man, this guy is awesome and spot on the Witcher
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/22-The-Witcher
You know what, I don't think anything this brainless (by his own admission) person utters is even worth using as toilet paper.
I got The Witcher the day it came out, and sailed through it in less than a week without even looking at the printed manual once, and I'm no Einstein.
One cannot help but wonder if the reason for his narration, as opposed to text, is that the same insurmountable intellectual obstacles that prevented him from mastering Ch.2 of The Witcher, did not also prevent his education to progress to the point where he had actually mastered the Alphabet.....
I agree, you don't really need a manual to fihure it out, but he is right about the story it bored the hell out of me and I couldn't care less about it. I hated the main character, I hated the combat and I hated the interface and all those skills/perks that all look similar. The Witcher is insanely overrated game.
That is fine, pavel, that is your personal opinion, and everybody is entitled to his own personal opinion. I will in all likeliness not find any value in games that you have enjoyed, and that is also fine, seeing that gaming, just as reading for personal pleasure, is a personal and subjective experience linked to the personality and tastes of the person indulging in it.
Millions of people the world over love the Harry Potter books. Although I have very much enjoyed watching the movies, I found the books to be rather disappointingly shallow and childish, and I did not persist beyond reading a chapter or two, as I found no real value in continueing.
Millions of people around the world did find value in voraciously snapping up every copy of the series as they were being written.
For me now, to go and say: "The Harry Potter books are insanely overrated, because I hated them and I think theyr'e a load of crap", doesn't really make much sense, does it? That is clearly my own personal experience and has nothing to do with the fact that millions of people other than myself, would not agree with my opinion.
As a matter of fact, Pavel, I do wish to differ with you on the point that the game is overrated. I tend to visit the forums over at Gamespot's gamefaqs, while playing more action-orientated games, and 3-4 days after Witchers release, gamers on the board were bitterly complaining about the fact that the Gamespot review had given the game "only" 8.5.
I went over to the review to check it out, and saw a clamour of gamers attacking the review, with most of the actual gamers giving it a much higher rating -some even giving at as high as a 10 - this in spite of the fact that this is admittedly a technically flawed game. (The engine is a bit old and loading times are insane). (I checked now, and I see the gamers' average is still sitting at 9.5)
In other words, the actual gamers (not the official reviewers) were enjoying this game so much that some of them were even prepared to overlook the few obvious glitches in the game to give it a perfect score. (Imo the perfect game does not exist -but passion sometimes overrides perfection)
I could gave you a long exposition of reasons as to why I personally enjoyed the game, and found a lot of value in it, but this is probably the wrong thread for that.
All I can say is that I'm sorry that you missed out on what a large amount of other people found to be a great experience.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 9:02am |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | I will in all likeliness not find any value in games that you have enjoyed,
why not? Just because I disliked the Witcher?
Millions of people the world over love the Harry Potter books.
I wouldn't touch them with a 10 foot pole. And I hate Tolkien too. I used to like reading fantasy, but now i am pretty much done with it except for Gerge R. R. Martin and a few select others.
And when I said Witcher is overrated, I don't just mean the sites, I also mean all those fan reviews. The fan reception is shocking. But I am used to it because "if you listen to fools the mob rules". What is really funny is that Dark Messiah of Might and Magic was better than the Witcher in almost every way possible.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=TWKRkhpFqhE
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IhuzuKIPsE8&feature=related
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_D89tGxHx0c&feature=related
http://youtube.com/watch?v=h3ZyZjC2nvA&feature=related
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 4:14pm |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By pavel4444 (30 MAY 2008 11:11pm)
I agree, you don't really need a manual to fihure it out, but he is right about the story it bored the hell out of me and I couldn't care less about it. I hated the main character, I hated the combat and I hated the interface and all those skills/perks that all look similar. The Witcher is insanely overrated game.
Everyone has their own opinions on a game and that's fine. Even the best loved classics of all time will have their detractors, and that's fine also. Sorry you didn't like "The Witcher" pavel. For me, "The Witcher" is my first full blown rpg and I love it: The story, atmosphere, characters, combat, interface, etc. are all well done.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 6:32pm |
pavel4444Space Cadet
Posts : 124
Joined: 2 MAY 2008
Status : Online | Well I am sorry that you DID like i and sorry that it was your first RPG experience and sorry that you think it is a full blown RPG.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 6:39pm |
| Deleted User | Okay Pavel, I get your point, you didn't like "The Witcher". However, I won't get into a pissing contest. Have a good day.
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| 31 MAY 2008 at 7:42pm |
papillonSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 340
Joined: 3 JUL 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By TheTraveler (30 MAY 2008 8:28pm)
You know what, I don't think anything this brainless (by his own admission) person utters is even worth using as toilet paper.
I got The Witcher the day it came out, and sailed through it in less than a week without even looking at the printed manual once, and I'm no Einstein.
One cannot help but wonder if the reason for his narration, as opposed to text, is that the same insurmountable intellectual obstacles that prevented him from mastering Ch.2 of The Witcher, did not also prevent his education to progress to the point where he had actually mastered the Alphabet.....
Well, the main problem seems to be that the guy hates cutscenes or anything that forces him to sit and watch/read the story. And doesn't like RPGs in general, partly because, well, cutscenes are common. Having seen some reviews of his both for games he did like and games he didn't like, he seems to get irritated by any non-interactive stuff that goes on for more than the tiniest period of time and prevents him from Doing Stuff.
Which, yes, does make it slightly ironic that he produces video content for people to sit back and watch.
[url=http://whineaboutgames.blogspot.com]I Whine About Games[/url]&&&&[url=http://www.hanakogames.com]Anime Games[/url]
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