| 22 JUN 2006 at 7:05pm |
RHBIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 3
Joined: 4 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Yeah, I agree. I don't get it at all. The major protagonist (Zoe) is made to fail at both of her missions. We possibly get some closure on Reza, but it's very vague. However, April Ryan ends up being heartlessly run through with a spear and left floating, dead, face down in a swamp. Since Zoe's task was to "find April, save April", she did the first but not the second. Call me a sentimentalist, but my warm memories of April Ryan from TLJ really got roughed
up there. I can read about bad stuff every day from Iraq, and I don't desire that in a form of entertainment like an adventure game. Also, Zoe ends up dead herself at the end and the bad
guys win. What great storytelling! Maybe Norwegian winters have been especially bad since 2000.
Dreamfall was an automatic buy after TLJ, but I don't care if they do a third one or not, :'( I won't be interested.
rhb
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| 22 JUN 2006 at 7:15pm |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | I absolutely agree with you. Especially your comment about how bad things happen in the world every day that we can't make good. When you're playing a game, it's kinda rewarding, if you do everything right, to have a positive outcome. More than that though, I really wanted some kind of resolution with more of the characters- even if they wanted to leave something hanging so you'd have to buy the next game to find out what happens. I mean, even poor Benrime was just kinda brushed off in a quick conversation! And you're so right about Zoe completely failing- leaves you shaking your head.
And I really like the way you could move through the 2nd game and the look of it and all too. I have a Norwegian friend, maybe I'll ask him about this...
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| 22 JUN 2006 at 11:32pm |
nytimesguyPrivate Detective
Posts : 684
Joined: 14 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Dreamfall's ending is one of these mid-tirlogy endings you see now and again. Remember the annoying ending of the second Star Wars movie, or of the book The Vampire Lestat? It's as though the writer feels their story is so important and profound that they can give you a crap ending and make you wait years for answers and a decent resolution. It's disgusting.
Charles - Game Theorist
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| 23 JUN 2006 at 2:18am |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Well said.
PS- Love your sense of humour.
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| 23 JUN 2006 at 4:06am |
RHBIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 3
Joined: 4 JUN 2006
Status : Online | My remarks above follow the "what you see is what you get" notion that there aren't any more characters' fates to be revealed in future episodes and that, though the storyline may eventually be carried on (it depends on sales!), it will be done with new characters. I don't like the way it all worked out, but at least it's respectable.
But the gentleman's comment about it's being a mid-trilogy ending may also be right and in this case one is dealing with shameless cliffhangers and no resolutions at all. Zoe may not be dead, April may not be dead, etc.,etc., ad nauseam.
Either way, I don't like it.
rhb
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| 23 JUN 2006 at 9:33pm |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Well, I guess it makes me feel somewhat better that I'm not the only one with these feelings. Really too bad though.
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| 24 JUN 2006 at 10:44am |
dirk_sevenIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 5
Joined: 23 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Hi
I've wrote a report for this game for amazon.com , which I'll share here too
just to show you how I felt about the whole game.
***** from amazon.com
I've played both The Longest Journey and DreamFall to the very end. Usually I can tell from playing an adventure game for like half an hour if it's good or not, as being fan of adventures like for example Police Quest series, Little Big Adventure, Syberia 1/2, return to mystery island etc. I was sold from the very start of this great sequel of The Longest Journey.
Ok, so far my intro. Now let's go ahead to the game itself.
I did found Dreamfall a bit shorter than it's previous version, as the graphics were of course a bit less in the first version of The Longest Journey there was more story to my idea.
Dreamfall's graphics are really stunning and I was surprised to see the character Zo? in her underwear on bed when you start to play, as for fans of the previous version know April Ryan started of the same way, when she suddenly was in the dream world.. Yes in her underwear.
Guess the creators didn't want to skip this opening detail and make Dreamfall for some of us males interesting from the start as well
The storyline is great, I must say it would be nice if you'd played the original version as on some point it's difficult to understand what they are talking about even for me it was sometimes difficult, as I played the original version years ago..
Nevertheless they did a good job in having the characters tell about themselves, so even if you have not played the original version before you get some information about their past.
And for myself it was good to catch-up again where the game left of years ago.. After these years I've forgotten a lot about most details.
Also the person you are now playing (Zo?) is a nice sweet character with an English accent, April was a lot tougher.. but don't worry you get her to play too again
That's the whole beauty of Dreamfall, it's really nice to play each character and see how their paths cross each other literally!
Even there are scenes where you have to work with each other, both Zo? and April, you get to talk to your own playable character sometimes which is very fun and interesting at the same time.
During the game you also get to make decisions, while talking to people. To say yes, or no or act defensive, offensive etc.
The character you speak to will respond depending on your answers.
I don't really believe any answer would screw things up, or make you go on a different way.
So far for me there was only 1 occasion where my answers would lead to an extra ticket for a little girl when being in Japan, if you did it wrong you only got yourself 1 ticket and left a girl behind.
Also here I don't believe it would have resulted in a different story line, sometimes you get to see some more or less scenes that's all I think.
It would have been nice if you really would get alternate endings, but to my knowledge there is only 1 way to go.. believe me , I did try a couple of scenes over and over again to see if it would do me any good or not
The game play is great, I've played the whole game with the keyboard not any problem. You just have to get used to it, which takes a little moment.
Point is, you do not want to use the mouse when walking... Only use it for looking around if you want to see something in particular. For the rest, if you stop moving your character the camera will center behind your character, making it possible for you to see things ahead.
It worked out great for me, so I'm sure if will for you too.
Fighting isn't that hard too, go down the gym and practice till you get it right.
I used ASDW for walking and LK for fighting, space blocking. It works out the best, again camera goes by itself. Try and see, so all negative comments in the reviews about that are to my opinion not relevant.
The ending... well, indeed it also leaves me with unanswered questions, so hopefully a quicker sequel than this one against the 1st version years back.
Also what I found to be nice about the game in general was the way to solve puzzles, I know they could have made them a bit harder, but at least you didn't have to run around all way back too often to get items.
Most of the times you can find the solution in the running scene.
If you are stuck, usually your mobile phone comes in with a solution. Every puzzle was quite well to solve with some common sense.
I absolutely recommend this game and if you have not played the 1st version, buy that one too. It's really great and will help you understand the story more.
I'm even thinking about playing it again, just to refresh my memory again and perhaps already answers some of the unanswered questions I have still.
Hoped you like my preview and it's of some help to you, if so I might do this more often for games.
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| 24 JUN 2006 at 5:10pm |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Hi Dirk- I agree with all the good things you said about the game. That's why I was so disappointed about the ending. I guess I just felt that the writers resorted to using too many cutscenes at the end, and they just dropped a lot of the characters with no resolution. But, all the good things you have to say are absolutely true. Thanks.
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| 27 JUN 2006 at 3:28am |
MikekellyPrivate Detective
Posts : 612
Joined: 25 JUN 2004
Status : Offline |
I got that "Empire Strikes Back" feeling from Dreamfall...................
There will be a third !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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| 27 JUN 2006 at 2:49pm |
RHBIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 3
Joined: 4 JUN 2006
Status : Online | I was pretty negative in my remarks above, so I'll balance that off a little now by mentioning a couple of things (from many, really) that I liked about the game.
When Zoe views the datacube left by Dr. Park in the dollhouse, I think we see one of the most excruciatingly sad and tragic episodes ever shown in a game. Totally memorable. Well-written, well-depicted, well-voiced, and the background music (especially with what I assume is a trumpet) is perfect. I went through that scene a good 4 times again and then had Zoe go back into the room just so I could let what I'd seen settle in and listen to that haunting music more. (Idea for a spinoff game: the descendants of Gus and Victoria MacPherson hunt down and bring retribution to those who committed that mostrous crime against little Faith.)
Also, who couldn't be moved by the scene where Zoe meets Faith in the dollhouse? Great artistry is shown here also.
rhb
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| 27 JUN 2006 at 3:19pm |
nytimesguyPrivate Detective
Posts : 684
Joined: 14 OCT 2002
Status : Online | That's what I find so frustrating about Dreamfall. There really was some brilliant stuff in there, and I really liked the look and the interface. But the gameplay was worthless and the ending was a big let down. If only game designers would show me their games early I could tell them where they're going wrong. ;-)
Charles - Game Theorist
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| 27 JUN 2006 at 5:47pm |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Originally Posted By Mikekelly (27 JUN 2006 3:27am)
I got that "Empire Strikes Back" feeling from Dreamfall...................
There will be a third !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I just finished playing the 1st episode- if there isn't a 3rd (even a 4th or 5th), I'll be surprised!! The writing couldn't be more obvious. [smiley=raise_eyebrow.gif]
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| 27 JUN 2006 at 5:56pm |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | Originally Posted By RHB (27 JUN 2006 2:48pm)
I was pretty negative in my remarks above, so I'll balance that off a little now by mentioning a couple of things (from many, really) that I liked about the game.
When Zoe views the datacube left by Dr. Park in the dollhouse, I think we see one of the most excruciatingly sad and tragic episodes ever shown in a game. Totally memorable. Well-written, well-depicted, well-voiced, and the background music (especially with what I assume is a trumpet) is perfect. I went through that scene a good 4 times again and then had Zoe go back into the room just so I could let what I'd seen settle in and listen to that haunting music more. (Idea for a spinoff game: the descendants of Gus and Victoria MacPherson hunt down and bring retribution to those who committed that mostrous crime against little Faith.)
Also, who couldn't be moved by the scene where Zoe meets Faith in the dollhouse? Great artistry is shown here also.
Hey RHB- I think the thing is, as so many people are pointing out, that there were some very good elements to the game, but the flaws (mostly at the end) left you feeling cheated. I think that's why we're being so harshly critical- you know, when you're having fun, and then...
I really liked the part where Zoe and Faith met too (that was the most memorable part for me), and the writing about the sinister connection in their relationship was good. And I'll say it again- I liked the way the characters moved through the game, and how the puzzles were an integral part of the story. Reall lots of good stuff- but as a performing artist the one thing we were always told was to leave your audience with a good last impression (the rest can be mediocre, but if the ending is good that's what they'll remember).
So now the question is - To spend $$ on the next installment or not?
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| 28 JUN 2006 at 9:37am |
Lurker01Private Detective
Posts : 411
Joined: 23 JUN 2004
Location: US
Status : Offline | I really didn't like the ending. Killing off all the heroes left, right and centre? It seems kind of hard to imagine how a sequel would be possible after what they did. Except, right at the end, after the ending credits, there was a meeting between Cortez and Brian. 'Time is a circle.' makes me think that the next one might involve someone going back and trying to correct the moments where things went wrong in Dreamfall.
Come to think of it, in each case death is only the most likely outcome for the characters. The plot kind of vagues up death scenes and avoids showing us the bodies or anything else that would allow us to be certain they died. It is simply the most likely outcome in each case. Even in April's case all we know is that she was severely wounded and fell into the swamp.
I think I would buy the next installment.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
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| 29 JUN 2006 at 5:21am |
nytimesguyPrivate Detective
Posts : 684
Joined: 14 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Yeah, I'm not really sure if anyone is dead or not. I wouldn't be surprised if everyone killed off in Dreamfall shows up in the sequel. In fact, I'll be pretty annoyed if April doesn't show up in the sequel, since that's really a lousy resolution for a character I fell in love with in the first game and who was far more interesting and complex than the main character in Dreamfall. But maybe Ragnar just likes the way JK Rowling keeps killing off beloved characters and wanted to do the same thing himself.
Charles - Game Theorist
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| 29 JUN 2006 at 6:15am |
Lurker01Private Detective
Posts : 411
Joined: 23 JUN 2004
Location: US
Status : Offline | Don't bet on it. You would have a hard time actually killing this many main characters and persuading people to buy a sequel.
Edit: Besides, if you're going to do that then why leave room for doubt? Why not just make it clear that they're dead?
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
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| 29 JUN 2006 at 5:39pm |
PoyntenklikSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 201
Joined: 25 AUG 2005
Status : Online | I just finished dreamfall after playing it solidly for a week. I loved it. If ever a game has drawn me to love characters, it was this one. I couldn't help but feel totally drawn in by Zoe's personality, the way she looked, and the cute way she ran. I thought her voice acting didn't sound very professional at first, but tbh, it was perfect for her, it gave her a real sense of innocence. I almost cried in the ending scenes with the little girl faith about to die and Zoe dieing in the hospital bed, I felt a lump in my throat. :'(
I thought the story, albeit very sad and depressing at the end, an incredible one. I too am unclear about certain details but I see Dreamfall as nothing less than a masterpiece. An utterly beautiful game.
Regarding april dieing, Zoe is told at the end by faith that she did save april. I can only guess that april being killed could be seen as being saved by putting her out of her misery so to speak. There are references by characters in the story which are negative towards her pointless purpose in rebelling against the azadi. She had basically lost direction in her life. Just a guess. Questions I have:
Wasn't faith letting go and dieing supposed to mess up the dreamcore? Yet that didn't seem to be the case, the baddies were still around. What exactly was the meaning of brian westhouse in a buddhist temple at the start of the game being sent to the storytime place? Was that supposed to be part of the dreamnet thing? What was that undreamer thing that brian was scared of? And when zoe ends up in storytime at the end, is she meant to be in a kind of heaven, hell or dreamstate? Those are the sort of things that I don't understand and I'm sure many don't. I wonder if we're meant to simply create our own conclusions, and that perhaps beyond the main story of living lucid dreams, that the game creators actually don't have any concrete answers themselves.
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| 7 JUL 2006 at 10:51pm |
JerrySorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 363
Joined: 2 MAR 2003
Status : Online | Regarding April possibly being dead, don't forget the epilogue from TLJ, where you see her as a very old woman, which of course could not be possible if she's dead...
[url=http://www.intervocative.com/DVDCollection.aspx/Jerry2000]My dvd's[/url]
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| 8 JUL 2006 at 1:03pm |
Lurker01Private Detective
Posts : 411
Joined: 23 JUN 2004
Location: US
Status : Offline | There is certainly evidence to suggest that April survives, and quite a few things are implied about her and Kian. It's Zoë who you really have to wonder about. As for 'saving' April, that could mean any number of things.
Wasn't Faith letting go and dieing supposed to mess up the dreamcore? I did wonder about that bit. The answer is probably not.
I wonder if we're meant to simply create our own conclusions, and that perhaps beyond the main story of living lucid dreams, that the game creators actually don't have any concrete answers themselves. This certainly isn't true. The whole story has been pretty much planned out and we will get it, in one form or another. Ragnar Tornquist himself confirms this much.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
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| 14 JUL 2006 at 3:28pm |
AkhillesPrivate Detective
Posts : 581
Joined: 21 JUL 2003
Location: US
Status : Offline | I got the feeling that the entire game was really building up to something and then it just gave up.
Why did we spend time playing the other characters to not really do anything of any significance except with Zoe? It felt like controlling the other characters (April, whatshisface) was an add-on-later.
The story was great (except for the abrupt end). The first game (oh crap, I'm mentioning the other game!) seemed to be so deep.. and switching worlds was significant (to gameplay or story).
You are standing in an open field west of a white house, with a boarded front door. There is a small mailbox here.
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| 16 JUL 2006 at 3:32pm |
jedicriSpace Cadet
Posts : 111
Joined: 13 MAR 2005
Status : Online | There will definately be a third and final installment. According to Ragnar (from his blog anyway), the third episode will not take 3 years to develop --- well, let's hope so anyway.
As for April's "death" --- Lurker touched on it ever so slightly. There is a connection between April and Kian Alvane. Lady Alvane, aka April, is the old woman in TLJ.
Count me in for the final installment.....
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| 19 JUL 2006 at 5:31am |
tombraider333Intergalactic Janitor
Posts : 83
Joined: 11 JUN 2006
Status : Online | I do think I'll play the 3rd installment too. After playing the 1st part I'd like to find out how things end, but especially because I enjoyed how the characters moved through the game, and the atmosphere and locations in the 2nd game. I just hope there will be some kind of wrap up and endings for the characters.
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| 19 JUL 2006 at 12:30pm |
OobieDooIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 6
Joined: 18 JUL 2006
Status : Online | I finished Dreamfall last week and was not impressed! I was so looking forward to it too after TLJ. I found that I spent a good proportion at the start of the game getting used to (and fiddling with) the controls so my mind was more on controlling Zoe rather than getting immersed in the story. Eventually I just printed off a walkthrough. I didn't like the way you moved to a new scene (even if it was only a few short strides away) and had to wait while you got a new screen, nor did I like the change of characters once that screen loaded. One minute you were playing as Zoe, the next you were April, or that guy, Kian. Very disjointed! The fighting was irritating but easy. There were no puzzles as such, a couple of timed bits when you had to match symbols to open a door or something. Trolls! How I hate them. Twins, hate those too. You didn't pick up anything and it wasn't worth talking to the person/s you met on the street unless they were part of the game play. The ending just went on and on, no interaction, more like watching a movie.
My impression of Dreamfall? I finished the game. [smiley=thumbsdown.gif]
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| 20 JUL 2006 at 3:59am |
| Deleted User | Originally Posted By Jerry (7 JUL 2006 10:51pm)
Regarding April possibly being dead, don't forget the epilogue from TLJ, where you see her as a very old woman, which of course could not be possible if she's dead...
I came to the same conclusion that April is the old woman from TLJ. I am totally immersed in the storyline and look forward to the 3rd installment.
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