| 18 OCT 2002 at 7:54pm |
AdsoIntergalactic Janitor
Posts : 16
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Personally, it doesn't bother me too much if the doors close behind you once you enter a room. It does seem to be the way all games I've played do it.
The only reason it might be an issue is if there are other exits out of the room that have identical doors. If the door you came through stays open, then you can tell where you've been. I sometimes forget where I am. I guess I'm a little spatially challenged.
Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.&&&&Sir Winston Churchill
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| 18 OCT 2002 at 8:08pm |
bleepnikPrivate Detective
Posts : 544
Joined: 13 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | i agree that an open door, if there are multiple doors in the room, tells me where i came from. however, if the game is a spooky one, and the door creaks shut behind me, i guarantee that will creep me out each 'n' every time, and that would add to the ambience of the game
wow, that helped... not at all. sorry
.g
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| 18 OCT 2002 at 8:29pm |
mszvPrivate Detective
Posts : 751
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Hi,
Oh, what's realism anyway. After that flippant tone (couldn't resist), I think "it depends". Are you trying to signify a definitive break between rooms? o you want your player to think about whether they want to go back through the door? Is it windy, would the door close anyway? Is the door the entrace to a house - generally you close a door to a house, when you go in. oes the door closing sound add to the game? Does opening and reopening the doors add or detract from the mood and tone of the game? Is having the door close automatically something that most players would do in that situation, if they were really walking around in the game environment (not a showstopper, sometimes you want the game to do something a person would not do in "real life" to make it easier to play the game, establish a convention or mood, that sort of thing).
My suggestion would be to replay the game you have so far, with a fresh eye, looking at what happens when you go through a door. I'd also get a friend or two to play it. It's hard to look at something you are making with a fresh eye, your experiences with the game get in the way. Maybe, even if you didn't intend a particular effect with the doors closing, the effect is great - accidents are like that. I would not recode unless I had to. Only you can decide what works in your particular game.
Regards, mszv
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| 18 OCT 2002 at 8:49pm |
mbc841Space Cadet
Posts : 194
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Thanks for the suggests. In this game, the environment is a house, with bedroom doors and den doors etc. Tonight when I get home, I'll re-play what I have so far paying attention to the doors. There is a point in the game where all the doors are in fact automatic, so they'll stay as they are.
Oh, also, sorry if my first post sounded flippant, it wasn't meant to be. :-[
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| 18 OCT 2002 at 9:11pm |
mszvPrivate Detective
Posts : 751
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Was just taking a break and I saw the reply - no - my tone was flippant, not yours!
We're all looking forward to your game. Let us all know what else we can do to help.
Take care.
Regards, mszv
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| 18 OCT 2002 at 10:23pm |
emmaPrivate Detective
Posts : 525
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | IRL I never turn around to close the door, I do it "absentminded" with my hand behind my back sort of... I never felt it to be unrealistic that this happens in games. Since I don't have a *physical* appearance in a game, the sounds and movements are only reinforcement of my imaginations not actual movements.
To me it's perfectly realistic that the door closes behind me.
[URL=http://www.dvdprofiler.com/mycollection.asp?alias=emma]My DVDs[/URL] | [URL=http://www.adventuregamers.com/]AdventureGamers[/URL] | I haven't lost my mind, I've got a backup on a disc somewhere.
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| 19 OCT 2002 at 2:30pm |
mbc841Space Cadet
Posts : 194
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Thanks for the feedback everyone - I'm leaning toward leaving the doors just as they are -
(hope everyone likes ghosts, because there's one in my game - but he's a friendly ghost.)
Mike
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| 19 OCT 2002 at 2:48pm |
AyaGrand Inquisitor
Posts : 7277
Joined: 16 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | hope everyone likes ghosts, because there's one in my game - but he's a friendly ghost you got a licence for Casper?
about the doors... i prefer them to be left how i left them, but i don't much mind... i'd mind if the commands were typed cause then i'd have to type "open door" each time instead of just going through
You have gotten the attention of the mysterious lady. She turns to face you. Her face is devoid of any flesh. You are frozen with horror as she begins ripping your body into a bloody mess.
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| 23 OCT 2002 at 3:45pm |
SkyeSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 348
Joined: 20 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Originally Posted By mbc841 (18 OCT 2002 7:44pm)
You must re-open the door to exit the room. Logical? No. Realistic? NOT. I'm not really sure why I did it this way, other then to say that most "professional" games do it this way, and of course, I'm striving to make my game as "professional looking" as possible.
So, how important is this point to adventure game players? Should I go back through my game and re-do it so that all doors, once opened, STAY open, until and unless the player closes them?
In the game I am working on the doors (at least 99%) do close behind the player when entering a room. The main reason for doing this is if the player is allowed to leave doors open when they leave a room, it would make for a lot of extra sprite overlays on all the doors that are visible from various areas within the game world. Perhaps it is being lazy by not having the engine check every time there is a scene with a door to see if it is open or closed . . . . .
This same principle could be applied to everything else that the player interacts with such a drawers, windows, etc.(i.e. display the object in the state the player left it in) It just might not be as practical to be fully realistic in graphic games as it was in text/IF style games - too many sprites
My two cents worth!
Anne
Indie Developer of Scavenger Hunter&&The Replayable Adventure Game!&&- 4,446 scenes, 5,796 overlays,&&- First Indie Adventure Game&& To Use A.I. Randomizer Technology,&&- 7 years in the making!!! RELEASED !!!&&&&Order yours now at:&&[url]http://www.Sagewood-Software.ca[/url]
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| 23 OCT 2002 at 5:12pm |
bistroSorcerer Apprentice
Posts : 240
Joined: 15 OCT 2002
Status : Online | It doesn't bother me with the door closing behind me. Played quite a few other genre's where that's a common thing. The only exception to this would be entering a maze-like room with a couple of dozen doors (unless you had some mechanism with which to clue the player as to which doors have been used). Now...if it's the friendly ghost that's closing that door behind me it...well then, he/she is being awful rude.... :
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| 23 OCT 2002 at 5:36pm |
jamarchandSchattenjger
Posts : 1665
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Well guys. I posted this question, and read your articles.
My impressions:
Is fact, that, if a game pretends to be more realistic as possible, if you open a door, so this door only reamains closed, if closed by yourself.
It's only a little detail in adventure games, but, is evident that this detail means overall careful of the game designers.
Each action or interaction between the gamer and the game, must have logical consequences....here enter the REALISM.....tHE MOST PLEASURE FOR A GAMER, IS FEELING THE ADVENTURE LIKE A REAL WORLD, IMMERSIVE, SO - The atention to these details such doors and other objects are relevants to put the gamer INTO the game.
Every interaction between gamer and game need to be the most realistc as possible.
 &&&&[move]Actually playing SHIVERS and Rhem 2[/move]&&
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| 23 OCT 2002 at 8:23pm |
MichalNGrand Inquisitor
Posts : 7058
Joined: 14 SEP 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By jamarchand (23 OCT 2002 5:35pm)
Every interaction between gamer and game need to be the most realistc as possible.
Please no. That just isn't true. An ultra-realistic game wouldn't be fun at all. It would require the player to perform a number of repetitive and boring tasks which, while being completely realistic, have nothing to do with the game. Imagine if at the start of every game day the character would have to get up, take a shower, dress, make a breakfast, eat the breakfast... wouldn't that be realistic?
In the case of open/closed doors I agree that it's nice when they don't change state on their own, although I don't see it as a requirement. In general I don't think realism is the way to go. Games are entertaimnent. Not being realistic is the point.
I mean, if you wanted realism, you'd have to scrap 99% of games because their plots are wildly unrealistic. It just so happens that realistic plots aren't much fun
I forgot my sig.
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 2:17am |
jamarchandSchattenjger
Posts : 1665
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Adventure games must update, like any other human area.
The mystakes of the past, must be avoid.
Each carefull to details valorize the game.
There's no problem in the fact of let a door open.....You don't need to close all the doors that you opened! hehe.
If close doors is a problem for you....forget them...
Evident, that these details are not mean factors that make a game a funny enterteinment.
But is evident too, that take care to details, help any game to jump higher.
Year after year, gamers bacame more and more demandings. Is the natural evolution.
&&&&[move]Actually playing SHIVERS and Rhem 2[/move]&&
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 7:51am |
bleepnikPrivate Detective
Posts : 544
Joined: 13 OCT 2002
Location: US
Status : Offline | Originally Posted By jamarchand (24 OCT 2002 2:17am)
The mystakes of the past, must be avoid.
ROFL! "mystakes"? Was that intentional? OMG, that's too good. Thanks for the chuckle, jamarchand, intentional or not.
.gita
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 9:03am |
MichalNGrand Inquisitor
Posts : 7058
Joined: 14 SEP 2003
Status : Online | Originally Posted By jamarchand (24 OCT 2002 2:17am)
Adventure games must update, like any other human area.
The mystakes of the past, must be avoid.
Each carefull to details valorize the game.
I'm just pointing out that too much of a good thing can be a bad thing.
Doing something "just because you can" is not necessarily a good idea.
PS: It's MichaLN, not MichaIN, but I have to admit it's difficult to tell with the silly sans serif fonts.
I forgot my sig.
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 2:29pm |
jamarchandSchattenjger
Posts : 1665
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Offline | Sorry, Micha........but wish well-crafted games is not a personnal opinion, but a "commom sense", or at least, must be.
There's an open topic in this site, just for the game's developers, know the gamers preferences.
Developers are permanentelly working and researching tools to increment the adventure games overall. (that's includes "your's forgotten details"
Personnaly speaking, I tell you, that none detail will escape my critical analisis.
&&&&[move]Actually playing SHIVERS and Rhem 2[/move]&&
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 5:39pm |
mbc841Space Cadet
Posts : 194
Joined: 10 OCT 2002
Status : Online | The mystakes of the past, must be avoid.
OK everybody, I must confess, I'm an old fuddy duddy when it comes to Adventure Games - and while I CERTAINLY want the genre to survive, and thrive, I am most content, in fact, ecstatic, at playing the "old" games using the "old" technology - to me they're just FUNNER. I know this sounds so old fashioned, or so stubborn, but I can only say what I like.) So, part of my decision to make a game myself, was to make the kind of game that I and apparently many other adventure players love - the "old" style games - 1st person, point & click, slide-show, you know, the same old same old. No 3D worlds here. I wouldn't even know how to make a 3D game.
I will let the professional developers take the lead in technology, but I just want to make a game based on the tried-and-true techniques (tried and true among some Adventure game players like myself).
As for realism, sometimes when I play an adventure game, just like sinking into a good book, I want to escape reality, so everything does not have to be as realistic. Anyhow, there are valid points for both sides of the issue, and I certainly don't want to do anything to contribute to the demise of the genre. :
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 5:53pm |
mszvPrivate Detective
Posts : 751
Joined: 12 OCT 2002
Status : Online | Mbc841, you should make whatever kind of game you want, it's your game! From the demo, it looks like a good game, I know I'll enjoy playing it.
I started playing the demo (think I reported this in another forum) and I paid attention to the doors closing. I think it made the game a bit more mysterious and positively added to mood of the game. In another game, the doors closing might not work, but in this game it works well.
The game has an interesting and somewhat unusual ambience, both playful and a bit mysterious. I think your love of the "old" adventure game format comes through - it's an homage to a first person, point and click, slideshow. I enjoyed it.
Regards, mszv
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| 24 OCT 2002 at 8:19pm |
| Deleted User | I dont care that much about doors closing after we go in or out. we stil have to click on the door isnt it? sometimes, when i dont wanna go to the door , i just got sucked into the door. TLJ is a good example. I dont know how to say it. Its like , when i wanted to go into or out of a room and suddenly i changed my mind, i wont get into it. Like monkey island 4, i hate it when im near a door, i just got sucked into the door. like thres a magnetic force pulling me in. its irritating when ur in a game and suddenly u didnt even clicked on the door and u accidently went out or in.
realistic for the doors closing after we go out or in rooms, isnt a matter. its just how the mouse click effect is to a game.
but if i play a scary adventure game, and theres always a door closing behind me, thats just thrilling. and the creeking of the door.oooh.... it just haunts you . especially when u play it lets say 12 am and above. doors it is. Creeeeeeek.
resident evel has a great effect on doors. u anticipate it to open ...and when it opens, BAM....zombies
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